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Thread: Betfair Forum

  1. #1
    Senior Member Desert Orchid's Avatar
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    Betfair Forum

    I take it this has closed down?

    I'm just reading between the lines of the RP item and how they're referring to it in the past tense.

    I think I gave up on the place after a week or so, maybe 20 years back?

    The RP item lists professional people who used the forum under pseudonyms and talks about how much good stuff there was on it.

    That's not how I remember it.

    I remember it as a cauldron of warped egos mixing with psychotic sublife in an eddy to the base.

    Once or twice I tried to start a meaningful debate but hardly had I tapped the return key than my post would be bombarded with replies ninety per cent of which would be inane, insulting or both.

    I had a colleague at work who boasted about his sole use of the forum being to insult people, but that was the way he was in real life. Moronic didn't begin to describe the guy.

    Also, the place was so busy with so many people posting at cross purposes it became a waste of time trying to follow the few good debates.

    I suppose this forum was heading in that direction once upon a time. Thankfully, it has matured into a pretty decent place where impoliteness is relatively uncommon and the moderation team deserve a lot of credit for it.

    When I think back on the Betfair forum, I don't do so with any fondness whatsoever but I do wish I'd known who the 'good guys' were on it.
    Illegitimi non carborundum


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    I couldn't have put it any better myself Maurice. It was a dreadful place largely littered with lowlifes and trolls.

    Let's hope now it's gone they don't find there way on here.

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    Can't read it without subscribing

    But as it's been copied and pasted to the Betfair forum (that is still going ) I'll do the same here


    Betfair changed the face of the betting industry when launching what would become the world's largest online exchange 20 years ago. In two decades the company has muscled its way to the top of the division, capped by a mega merger with Paddy Power in 2016.
    An early companion for the nascent exchange was the Betfair forum, which brought together a community who not only traded on the exchange but also traded opinion, banter and insults with like-minded individuals.
    In an era long before Twitter and influencers on social media, the Betfair forum was racing's soundboard, a place where voices could emerge and be heard.
    It was also a place for professionals to share their expertise, while those with less experience had a chance to pick up valuable tricks of the betting trade. Not always without controversy, it was organic, real and more often than not entertaining to observe.
    Love Divine wins the 2000 Oaks, the first race traded on Betfair
    Love Divine wins the 2000 Oaks, the first race traded on Betfair
    Gerry Cranham (racingpost.com/photos)
    The beginning
    Betfair's first market was the 2000 Oaks at Epsom, won by Love Divine on June 9, on which just £1,476 was matched. It did not take long for business to mushroom and, by the time of the 2005 Oaks, more than £2.7 million was matched. It was a similar story for the forum, which started as a small and select community but expanded into its own universe.
    Mark Davies, part of Betfair's founding team
    We had a very loyal group of people at the start. The internet was right at its infancy back then and these things didn't exist – it was all new. Therefore the people who found us and used us absolutely loved us and coined the term for themselves as the 'Betfairians' and they became the group that would exchange banter on the forum. It brought those people together in the way a chatroom is absolutely meant to. They'd exchange stories about what they thought, their tips and the bets they'd made.
    The birth of Betfair: 'You're illegal and we're going to shut you down' - how the exchange survived and won
    Barry Orr, Betfair's current head of public relations and part of the company since 2003
    The reason behind the forum initially was that it mirrored the betting exchange. We brought people together to bet against each other and the forum was a natural community where those people could engage with each other. That's what it was all about – to create a community for people who bet on the exchanges to talk to each other. For racing it was a precursor for Twitter.
    Coming together
    Those who used the forum in its formative years remember a vibrant environment boasting a healthy mix of information and humour that made for an entertaining platform on which to engage.
    Joe Saumarez Smith, among the first ten to post on the forum as soapy j
    When the Betfair forum came along there was a remarkable number of shrewd people on there who taught other people how betting worked. They put up decent information, talked about the mathematics and explained that laying horses blind was not a good strategy. I think a lot of the early users of Betfair learned about gambling from the forum. I learned loads from it. There were lots of very sharp people and lots of people who were specialists in obscure areas.
    Professional punter Matt Williams
    The Betfair forum at its best was full of humour, useful information, the occasional bit of needle and a sprinkling of spite. There was a time when I was working on the Trading Post, in the Racing Post, and we had to cherry-pick the best content for use in the paper the following day. The forum had a generous, knowledgeable following, with various members of the racing press known to get involved from time to time, and things could often turn spicy on there. All the ingredients for a worthwhile, vibrant and social experience online.
    Barry Orr
    You had some of the finest racing minds on there. Obviously it was always under a pseudonym but initially there was great debate and some really interesting threads. It was real-time messaging. A race would just be over and someone would create a thread on it and you'd get 20 or 30 interactions straight away. Before anyone had ever heard the word 'influencers', there were people influencing on the forum, talking about betting in-running, talking about different software you could use or posting tips. Some really well-informed people would post and it was an exciting place.
    Graham Wheldon, Racing Post spotlight writer and on the forum as Chompy
    I'm not sure the Betfair forum was ever a community really – more a good place to wind people up. I think it was mainly pro punters on there, who in breaks between races would tap into the forum and mess around a bit. It was people dangling bait to see who would bite.
    Kevin Blake, ITV racing pundit known as Irish Whisper on the forum
    I don't have a racing background and wouldn't have had a lot of friends who were into racing and it's amazing the amount of people I met through the forum that I went on to meet at the racecourse, many of whom I'm still good friends with. At the time Betfair was a new frontier and I found it great. They put in an Irish forum fairly early and everyone got to know each other well. We'd meet up on the big racedays for a few pints.
    Barry Orr: "The forum was a community for people who bet on the exchanges"
    Barry Orr: "The forum was a community for people who bet on the exchanges"
    Alan Crowhurst
    Everyone a winner
    It was not just the Betfairians who benefited from the forum, with the brains behind the business using it as a sounding board for what was and wasn't working for their infant company. It was also a platform for would-be professional punters and aspiring journalists to cut their teeth.
    Mark Davies
    We used to use the forum quite a lot as the customer feedback. We'd read it and see what people wanted. They didn't necessarily feel they were telling us when they put it up and, like any third-party conversation, when you eavesdrop you get better feedback than when you ask for the feedback directly.
    Barry Orr
    From a business point of view, it kept people engaged with the website as well. When they weren't involved in the race, they'd go on to the forum. Our guys were always on the forum because, if there was a problem with the site or a market wasn't up properly, the first place you'd hear about it was on there.
    Kevin Blake
    I cut my teeth writing on there as a teenager. I started to write race previews and give opinions and you'd get feedback straight down the pipe with no sugar coating, so it wasn't a bad place to learn and it directly helped me. I was in college at the time and not enjoying it. I sent CVs everywhere and the only response I got was from the Irish Field, because Donn McClean was there at the time and he was familiar with my writing on the forum. They gave me a crack because of that.
    James Knight, Coral trader who posted on the forum as the mole
    It's very similar to Twitter now. Anyone who works for a bookmaker wants to be alive to what's going on. There were always bits and pieces that came into the public domain via the Betfair forum, so it definitely helped. If you didn't look at it you'd probably see a massive move for something and then realise someone posted it half an hour ago. Anyone who follows a sport closely will want to immerse themselves in anything where there's interesting news and views. It used to be quite funny and very informative at the same time.
    Paul Smith, Racing Post spotlight writer known as Quito on the forum
    Eddie Fremantle was a big user and, once you realised there were clever people on there, it paid to follow because you never know everything. There were some nuggets on there. It sailed a little too close to the wind sometimes but it was in the early days of online communities and a good way for like-minded people to discuss what was going on.
    James Knight (centre): "The forum used to be quite funny and very informative"
    James Knight (centre): "The forum used to be quite funny and very informative"
    Happy memories
    From big-priced tips to racing folklore, everything was covered in conversation on the forum in its heyday, with no shortage of tall tales from those closest to it.

    Joe Saumarez Smith
    There was a fantastic rugby league guy who knew the game inside out. He had no clue about staking but when he wrote out his thinking on a game it was fantastic. There was another guy called Don Butler. His forum name was Cubone. His spelling was atrocious but it was just the most fantastic history of racecourse bookmaking. The insight and the stories, you could read them for hours. That's what I miss. In the early years it was almost self-policing. If people posted good stuff others rewarded it, but if you just put up selections you'd get taken apart. It was gambling Twitter before its time.
    Paul Smith
    It was good fun and the characters were definitely there. Most of the people who were the funniest were the most informed. I remember ppking and janov, who was a tremendous character. He was a 6ft 10in giant with a broad Bristol accent. He was so sarcastic and posted some belters. Then there was a hapless Scottish tipster called Aceform, who was the good guy to ppking's villain. He did a series of tipping challenges, including 'One A Day, The Aceform Way'. I met a lot of them at the races and most were very different to how you imagined them to be and I still see some of them regularly.
    Kevin Blake
    There were some great old characters on there and a good few high-profile people. One that stands out was Mike Futter, who owned Monty's Pass and used to post on there. You couldn't read what he was saying and not back Monty's Pass for the National. He was open with everyone that he really fancied the horse. That was a memorable one. It was fun to read ppking, janov and Aceform, who tended to write as he would have spoken. He put up his bets every day and was clearly not the best punter. He was having a good bet one day on a horse over fences and the horse ended up refusing. He half jumped the fence and ended up stuck on top of it. The first post that came up on the original thread where he'd posted the selection was from ppking, saying: 'Your horse appears to be perched on top of a fence, Aceform.' It was merciless. There were plenty of professionals on there too, like Emmet Kennedy, Graham Cunningham, Justin O'Hanlon and Richard Hoiles.
    Graham Wheldon
    I used to use the 'specials' forum for Big Brother stuff. Some of that was quite useful. The main guy on there was DJ Sunset - he was worth following and a well-known punter. The specials forum was probably more useful than the racing one in my opinion and good fun when Betfair was at its peak.
    James Knight
    There were some good discussions on the ante-post forums where people would argue who was the better horse, Moscow Flyer or Azertyuiop, and those sort of debates that don't happen as much now. There were some clever people on there and, if you knew who the right people were, you could learn quite a lot. There used to be interesting things on the general betting threads – about the state of the industry, commission rates and Betfair's premium charge. There were some very well-informed people on there speaking about where betting was going and that's as much of a miss today as the silly fun stuff.
    Matt Williams
    At the beginning, and for a lengthy period of time, you had strength in numbers, which inevitably lends itself to healthy, often informative debate. It was a great place for punters to vent their frustrations over a bad ride, poor training performance, outrageous bad luck or an annoying pundit infiltrating your living room on any given day – and I wasn't immune from criticism myself. As long as it doesn't get too personal, I think that's a good thing. There were so many characters like Warwick hunt, DoubleD, muffinman and Alain Charnier, who were bang into their racing and prolific on there.
    Turning sour
    Despite such a positive, revolutionary beginning, the forum eventually started to take a different direction, with insight all too often being replaced with insults. A combination of Betfair's huge popularity and vast increase in users, as well the invention of various social media outlets, all had consequences.
    Mark Davies
    It was the best of Betfair but it was also the worst. It went through a period when it was utter misery because people would just say horrible things in the way they do on forums. I have as much sympathy for anybody as I was the target of quite a lot of the toxic posts because I was Betfair's public face. It's a bit like Twitter today, people think they can write what the hell they want.
    Barry Orr
    It was a bit of a minefield and did cause us some headaches in terms of who was responsible for the content that was aired on there. But it was never meant to be that sort of a place. It was meant to be a community talking about the exchange but a certain element seemed to take hold of certain threads and drove out a lot of well-informed people. Then Twitter came along and a lot of that opinion is on there now.
    Matt Williams
    Some of the stick dished out was unfair, maybe even out of order, and after a while the forum became quite toxic. Accusations of foul play and crooked rides used to fly around the place, as well as cruel jibes, and personally speaking I naturally moved away from the day-to-day involvement. I couldn't be arsed with the fact the scales, over time, were weighted in favour of the nasty stuff. I'd imagine it was a similar story for plenty of other members as well.
    James Knight
    That's the nature of social media – you get the early adopters who feel they are part of something different and it's all good fun and then you get an influx of anonymous people. As there was more abuse and anonymous people saying things about others, I think people became bored of it. Unfortunately, people turn down posting interesting stuff because they don't want to engage.
    The Betfair forum lives on to this day
    The Betfair forum lives on to this day
    Edward Whitaker
    The present day
    The forum lives on to this day but appears to have slipped down the pecking order as the place to be heard when the big talking points arise.
    Joe Saumarez Smith
    Forums are a little bit past it now. People have moved on to Twitter and younger bettors would consider it to be an old format.
    Mark Davies
    I've not followed it since I left Betfair but I would think the reason it's changed is as much a function of the growing user base as anything. When we had just a few thousand customers it was like a club but there's several million customers now. It's much harder to gain a cachet on there.
    Barry Orr
    There're still interesting people posting interesting stuff but it's not anywhere near as influential as it was.
    Kevin Blake
    After I've worked on TV I'll have a look because you know you'll get direct feedback on there and, even if it's nasty, I don't mind because there's often some truth in there.
    Matt Williams
    I'll still have a look at the forum and it's got some of the old characters lingering, those who have stood the test of time. And, like the old days, you can still pick up the odd nugget of info and get more than a whiff of decency.

  6. #4
    Senior Member an capall's Avatar
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    Remember when this place was unmoderated under the Channel 4 handle? Very unpretty at times.

    I specifically recall a poster 'Gary' - he could start a war in an empty room. Happily we have all grown up.
    "And still they gazed and still the wonder grew. That one small head could carry all he knew.

    And that small head knew that Impaire Et Passe would win the Champion Hurdle."

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    "It was merciless. There were plenty of professionals on there too, like Emmet Kennedy, Graham Cunningham, Justin O'Hanlon and Richard Hoiles."



    Sent from my SM-J415FN using Tapatalk

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    Tbh I was a long time poster on another forum and stayed on that platform only for probably 10 years it was the best bunch of guys you'd ever find on a forum (No offence) . I visited TRF i suppose in the days of the Antepost king and Ginge if they are still about and was Tanlic on there under the name of Fist or something? It wasn't for me. Betfair and this one back then were both as bad. I stayed away from here for a number of years but I'd got involved on the Final Furlong shortly before it shut down and I think he was called Hoofhearted on there and Ice breaker on here convinced me to come and give it a go and tbf its a good bunch of guys and gals on here now and I wish I'd got involved a bit earlier. I don't think the forums are quite what they once were but its such a wonderful platform and without trying to sound to over the top OHRacing back in the day changed my life (maybe saved my life) and if it weren't for that forum and the people who were kind enough to help me I wouldn't have achieved half of what I have to date and might have not even been here. I'm glad you guys have kept this going and hopefully the way you all are it will continue for a number of years more. Hopefully I'll get some sort of break from the personal problems that have plagued me for a number of years as I'd like to contribute more and hopefully once I've got rid of the rust I can find a few winners.
    Man who catch fly with chopstick .... accomplish anything.

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    Senior Member simmo's Avatar
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    Ah icebreaker, unfortunately he had a bit of a funny turn on here and decided that any criticism of the methods of Israel constituted anti-Semitism and chose to leave.

    That said, I think that the departure of himself and other users has made this a less antagonistic place - though chit chat is a lot less busy much to wolf's chagrin.
    Last edited by simmo; 17th July 2020 at 12:23 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by simmo View Post
    Ah icebreaker, unfortunately he had a bit of a funny turn on here and decided that any criticism of the methods of Israel constituted anti-Semitism and chose to leave.

    That said, I think that the departure of himself and other users has made this a less antagonistic place - though chit chat is a lot less busy much to wolf's chagrin.
    Didn't know about all that, he seemed a decent guy from the dealings I had with him although it always sticks with me that he sold his Bitcoin at the wrong time before most people knew what it was
    Last edited by Danny; 17th July 2020 at 12:27 AM.
    Man who catch fly with chopstick .... accomplish anything.

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    Senior Member simmo's Avatar
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    He seemed a decent sort to me too, just made some strange choices as far as this forum is concerned.

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    Icebreaker was a very helpful guy and a sad loss to this forum.

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    Senior Member Perpetual's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by littlelad View Post
    "There were plenty of professionals on there too, like Emmet Kennedy....."
    I'm not sure if this was intended as joke, but made me laugh so thanks littlelad

    I actually liked the Betfair forum and a bit like here, am more of a reader than writer. There were trolls but also a few gems, some really funny stuff, massive egos and great bust ups. I’ve never been into Soaps, but I think it was my version…. Also remember particularly enjoying the oncourse bookmaker threads which gave me a different view on stuff

    As for here, I’ll carry on as I do in life – avoid all the stuff that winds me up or have no interest in, but am committed to post as much as possible when the jumps gets going again in the Autumn

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    SDK will be gutted that he didn't get a mention. He was more of a chit-chatter though. That section of the forum is now closed. Don't know if they are closing it all down bit by bit but it will be no great loss.

    The first version of the betfair horse racing forum only allowed 50 posts maximum in any one thread, and maybe they should have stuck with that. Would have saved many people, including myself, much wasted time. It's taken me a lot of years to realize how all these forums are really just a waste of precious time. when the boss on here, Col, sent me a 'matey' pm but then started to delete some of my posts - innocuous ones, nothing controversial , he did me a favour. When the owner of a forum starts Gaslighting tactics then one really knows that it's the time to leave.

    Which is the way out without that option, though? I could tell him quite truthfully that he was **** at trying such amature tactics on me - never try to kid a kidder - or would it be quicker to just call him a ****, which he certainly is? Yes, that might do it. I certainly hope so!

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    I see thast s h i t and c u n t have been starred out. I'm sure he's now got the message though and shame on him any people of his ilk.

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    Senior Member simmo's Avatar
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    The post that I complained about was racist. If you think it was innocuous, you need to educate yourself.

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    I've just replied to you, simmo, to explain that it wasn't that photo I was talking about, tha was clearly not racist but taking the **** out of the white people in it. The posts of mine were wishing BG best wishes in his retirement and another in a similar vein. The post has vanished and this one will probably as well. I just hope that some will have seen it and see how corupt this forum is. Please get me out of here, Col, I want no part of this nonsense forum. Cheers.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Wolf View Post
    I've just replied to you, simmo, to explain that it wasn't that photo I was talking about, tha was clearly not racist but taking the **** out of the white people in it. The posts of mine were wishing BG best wishes in his retirement and another in a similar vein. The post has vanished and this one will probably as well. I just hope that some will have seen it and see how corupt this forum is. Please get me out of here, Col, I want no part of this nonsense forum. Cheers.
    I haven't deleted any posts at all from you apart from the photo, that there was more than one complaint about, and I explained the reason it was being deleted.

    You asked if I could pop an explanation into the thread as to why it was deleted, I replied to clarify you wanted that doing, and you didn't reply. Please don't try to make out I ignored you, I didn't, as you know.

    I have checked and no other posts of yours have been deleted by me or any other mod, so that is complete rubbish. However, as your views are clear, I'll ban you as thats clearly what you want.
    Last edited by dvds2000; 19th July 2020 at 10:52 AM.

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    There’s no need to ‘bait’ the person that makes this place exist for those of us that appreciate it Wolf. Col Rightly moderates stuff that shouldn’t be posted, and in all the years I’ve been posting on here he’s never been heavy handed about it. Despite having to deal with plenty of idiots along the way.

    Hopefully you’ll re-read your own posts this morning and delete them yourself after you realise how you’ve come across. And remember, you’re perfectly capable of getting yourself out of here if you so wish. You don’t need a helping hand by using the dramatics. It isn’t really necessary.

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    Admin log of all actions carried out by mods and admin over the last month.

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    Senior Member simmo's Avatar
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    I'm not suggesting any skulduggery on the part of admins, but I actually remember wolf making a post in the BG thread, which is no longer there.

    I remember it because it was a change from the usual moaning about the forum that characterised most of his posts.

    Strange one.

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    Quote Originally Posted by simmo View Post
    I'm not suggesting any skulduggery on the part of admins, but I actually remember wolf making a post in the BG thread, which is no longer there.

    I remember it because it was a change from the usual moaning about the forum that characterised most of his posts.

    Strange one.
    He also said a few weeks ago that something was deleted, which again, I replied to and his response was that it was a mistake

    https://www.talkinghorses.co.uk/foru...l=1#post738453

    The only thing I can think is that something was posted around the 4th/5th June which was when the server migration was taking place, which I posted about here

    https://www.talkinghorses.co.uk/foru...892#post737892

    I can guarantee 100% nothing, apart from the picture, was deleted by me or any mod though, despite the claims made. As I say, I sent a PM in reply to his that wasn't replied to, and when I asked about his claim on the thread, he said it was a mistake.

    I could have checked the database at the time to see if there was any missing lines, which would indicate an error at some point, but refusing to answer any questions to give me an idea where to look pretty much stops me being able to do anything

    Calling the forum corrupt and me a c**t isn't really the best way to get me to look into things though

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