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Thread: Flat Season 2020

  1. #41
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    Yes especially as the weather has been so good too. It’s not like you can say the cold weather has held them back and they haven’t come in their coats. Everything should be gleaming by now!
    tu ne cede malis, sed contra audentior ito

  2. #42
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    Quote Originally Posted by luckyme View Post
    A few stable tours for people to read if interested.....

    https://bet-master.freeforums.net/th...ble-tours-flat

    This was updated again yesterday absolutely loads of stuff for this flat season.

  3. #43
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    Quote Originally Posted by jinnyj View Post
    Unlike Stoutey to have them so forward! If he’s had a winner already then definitely worth keeping on the right side of his.
    A double today
    tu ne cede malis, sed contra audentior ito

  4. #44
    Senior Member Tout Seul's Avatar
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    Guineas Weekend At Newmarket, Irish Guineas next week. Hopefully get season really going on here.

    I’ll start up a thread for each of the four races. I can give some background to the two fillies races but very sparse on the colts. Who’s got any strong fancies?

  5. #45
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    Yes.

    I wonder where forum member Outsider is? He liked the flat. I hope he is alright.

    There are two or three so called handicappers stepping up to take on the group horses tomorrow. They are Escobar and Vale Of Kent.

    They are both very good horses.

    I might select Vale Of Kent for old time sake. Myself and Outsider had many a debate about him.

    My overall theory or hunch is that there is increasingly less and less material difference between a very good handicapper and a group three or even group two horse.

    They are usually underbet or underrated when they step up into the group races. I am absolutely sure plenty will step up and win their fair share of races at value odds this season.
    Last edited by Marb; 4th June 2020 at 7:46 PM.

  6. #46
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    Quote Originally Posted by Marb View Post
    Breathtaking Look is a mare I am very keen on seeing again. She improved 20lbs + on her original rating by the end of 2019. The highlight was beating good opposition in the Group 3 Sceptre Stakes at Doncaster when making all which is her customary way of running.

    I am happy to put a line through her following all weather defeat. I feel she will prove her Doncaster win was no fluke.

    Stuart Williams has a very exciting prospect to look forward to. A fast mile in a Group 3 around a track like Epsom in a race like the Queen Elizabeth Stakes at the Derby meeting for older fillies and mares would be absoloutely perfect.
    She's run with a lot of credit today.

    Roll on her next race!!!
    Last edited by Marb; 5th June 2020 at 2:37 PM.

  7. #47
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    Can’t not be impressed with English King today. Handled the track well and has plenty of improvement still.
    Also Coronation Cup winner is a beast to look at. Second and third ran with credit too.
    tu ne cede malis, sed contra audentior ito

  8. #48
    Senior Member Desert Orchid's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jinnyj View Post
    Can’t not be impressed with English King today. Handled the track well and has plenty of improvement still.
    Also Coronation Cup winner is a beast to look at. Second and third ran with credit too.
    Certainly disposed of the other jf easily enough and they were well clear of the next. I'm not sure it was a hot race but agree about the impression.

    I can't believe the Godolphin beast was allowed to go off odds-against given his advantage on all the ratings. Looked a monster in the first half of the race and was always well in control. I look forward to seeing some sectionals although I'm not sure if they have them at Newmarket.
    Illegitimi non carborundum


  9. #49
    Senior Member Desert Orchid's Avatar
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    Angus McNae has just contributed a socially-distanced analysis of the sectionals.

    He says Ghaiyyath ran 11 successive sub-12sec furlongs, something 'very few horses can do'.

    He closed with the word 'monster'.
    Illegitimi non carborundum


  10. #50
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    Should have stuck to training, he was much better at that.
    Ah! but a man's reach should exceed his grasp......

  11. #51
    Senior Member Desert Orchid's Avatar
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    I don't watch RTV much, Colin. I take it you're not convinced either by sectionals or by AMcN?

    Want to elaborate?
    Illegitimi non carborundum


  12. #52
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    Quote Originally Posted by Colin Phillips View Post
    Should have stuck to training, he was much better at that.
    Not aware of AM's training achievements, but that he isn't doing it now tells its own story.
    Wouldn't have him as a sectionals guru either. Fast ground form with a tailwind for the last 10f isn't something that happens frequently on the Rowley Mile track, imo.

  13. #53
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    Not a Fan of McNae at all. DO. It's quite a long time since I stopped subscribing to RTV but he always struck me as being lazy with homework and much too smug - his stats as a trainer were quite reasonable (perhaps it was too much like hard work), reet.

    I'm quite sure sectionals are invaluable to some but the interpretation and use of them are a bit beyond my old Welsh grey cells.
    Ah! but a man's reach should exceed his grasp......

  14. #54
    Senior Member PlaceBacker's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PlaceBacker View Post
    Cracker of a run to finish 2nd
    Gold Trip despite still being a maiden runs in a Group 2 today [4.25 Lyon]

    But think he will run with credit, so each way @ 17-2 [Paddy Power]
    "The wise man is one who knows what he does not know"

  15. #55
    Senior Member Desert Orchid's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Colin Phillips View Post
    Not a Fan of McNae at all. DO. It's quite a long time since I stopped subscribing to RTV but he always struck me as being lazy with homework and much too smug - his stats as a trainer were quite reasonable (perhaps it was too much like hard work), reet.

    I'm quite sure sectionals are invaluable to some but the interpretation and use of them are a bit beyond my old Welsh grey cells.
    My little cells are almost as grey as yours, Colin, but I'm embracing the value of sectionals. I did subscribe to Timeform's for a season but 90% related to AW racing and there were no Flat ones for Newmarket or Ascot's straight course, which is no use to me. I think that will change.

    For me, they give a better quantification of performance over and above bare ratings. If I reckon a horse has won despite the race not being run to suit I put a + next to the rating. Sectionals allow me to put a figure on the +.

    That aside and even allowing for a tailwind, eleven sub-12-second furlongs (in a 12f race) has to be pretty special. A lot of tracks have a figure around 60-seconds for their 5f standard time. He's maintained that speed for more than double the distance.
    Illegitimi non carborundum


  16. #56
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    Add to that the fact of doing so on a more or less straight track from the front, no pacemaker involved.
    A top performance reminiscent of New Approach's Champion stakes win

  17. #57
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    Good performance by Far Above there but he definitely looked lame on his near fore coming back into the winners enclosure.
    tu ne cede malis, sed contra audentior ito

  18. #58
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    I just wonder when and where Stoute plans to run Highest Ground.

    What Derby trials are coming up in the next week or two?
    Last edited by Marb; 6th June 2020 at 3:55 PM.

  19. #59
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    What's the nearest thing to a derby trial at Royal Ascot?

    I am sure there is a 3 year old only handicap over 1M4F?

    Who knows.
    Last edited by Marb; 6th June 2020 at 4:08 PM.

  20. #60
    Senior Member simmo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Marb View Post
    What's the nearest thing to a derby trial at Royal Ascot?

    I am sure there is a 3 year old only handicap over 1M4F?

    Who knows.
    King Edward VII Stakes 1m4f 3yo.

    Think there is also the wolferton but not 100% sure about that one.

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