View Poll Results: Brexit, Stay or Leave.

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Thread: Brexit

  1. #1621
    Senior Member simmo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by clivex View Post
    hes an absolute cnt. The genial side is just a front. A really nasty piece of work
    nice piece of self-analysis there clive.

  2. #1622
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    Quote Originally Posted by Grasshopper View Post
    Corbyn has said that all Labour MPs are likely to be subject to "a full and open selection process" in future, which is about as clear a threat of an impending purge after the Leadership vote, as you could ask for.
    So the promise of no mandatory reselection is out of the window? I haven't read this up but this was clearly the plan all along.

    You can just imagine what labour mps are thinking of him and his cronies now. Flood a local branch with smelly loser students and kick out some hardworking local mp of some years standing.
    Last edited by clivex; 21st July 2016 at 2:38 PM.

  3. #1623
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    As I've said previously I am not a Corbyn supporter - but I find it quite extraordinary that a conservative supporter has joined the Labour Party in order to vote against him. Extraordinary behaviour imo.

    The cries that I am hearing from Labour supporters are that the £25 charge is ruling out large swathes of the people who Labour are supposed to be protecting from voting (disabled, unemployed etc), that the requirement for MP re-selection is due to the infiltration of right-wingers into the party during the Blair/Brown years (and they definitely have a point there) and other rhetoric of a similar nature.

    I am not in favour of a return to 1970's Labour. Nor am I in favour of a return to Brown style Labour. I actually think that the sooner a split happens the better - at least for one election we need to see how much the electorate, rather than the membership of the Labour Party, want a truly left-wing opposition. 1983 showed that the votes (if not the seats) were split fairly evenly between the SDP/Lib Dem alliance and Labour. I think these days that would be a win for an SDP - I don't believe that the majority of left-leaning folks out there want a return to the 1970's, they just don't want a choice of Tories or Tory-light.
    Last edited by simmo; 21st July 2016 at 2:44 PM.

  4. #1624
    Senior Member simmo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by clivex View Post
    So the promise of no mandatory reselection is out of the window? I haven't read this up but this was clearly the plan all along.

    You can just imagine what labour mps are thinking of him and his cronies now. Flood a local branch with smelly loser students and kick out some hardworking local mp of some years standing.
    You're just ranting pish now, like a person with rabies frothing at the mouth. Have a sit down and watch some nice test cricket.

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  5. #1625
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    Quote Originally Posted by Grasshopper View Post
    Corbyn has said that all Labour MPs are likely to be subject to "a full and open selection process" in future, which is about as clear a threat of an impending purge after the Leadership vote, as you could ask for.
    which is exactly why..it wasn't a shrewd move time biding either at the last leadership election or this one..those shrewdies like Jarvis..Benn Chukka and Hunt will be lucky to even be mps never mind holding back for future leadership

    sitting back was a real daft move imo...the only way that either of those will be leaders of a party is if the split from labour..which clearly we all think will happen..but have they got the backbone to break away?..i'm not seeing it..what i am hearing is a desperate clinging on to Smith beating him and even the thought of corbyn winning isn't an option in their heads..just daft..ignoring what will happen..sort of wishing it away.

    i'm starting to think they will just go along with corbyn as leader and keep their gobs shut..no one seems to have a backbone out of those 4..there is only Owen Smith + Angela Eagle had the bottle to try and stop him..others are spineless..and its that spinelessness taht makes me think setting up a new party will be beyond them...it would mean actually making a big decision..which seems beyond them.

  6. #1626
    Senior Member Grasshopper's Avatar
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    Ummuna, Benn and the like know that the Party Membership are behind Corbyn, and have therefore concluded that any leadership-attempt is doomed to failure regardless. Why waste the time and the energy mounting a futile campaign?

    Defeat basically means that the Membership have aligned themselves to a different value-system than those held by the politicians you mention (plus tens of others, no doubt). There would be no future for these individuals in Corbyn's Labour Party, and the only options open to them would either be to create a new Party, or join an existing one they feel they can align to........or leave politics altogether. The way things look, the Labour Party as we have known it for the last 25 years, is beyond saving, and once this vote is over, it will become an even greater howl-at-the-moon irrelevance, than it is now.
    "Beat the price and lose. It's what we do".

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  7. #1627
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    Quote Originally Posted by Grasshopper View Post
    Ummuna, Benn and the like know that the Party Membership are behind Corbyn, and have therefore concluded that any leadership-attempt is doomed to failure regardless. Why waste the time and the energy mounting a futile campaign?

    Defeat basically means that the Membership have aligned themselves to a different value-system than those held by the politicians you mention (plus tens of others, no doubt). There would be no future for these individuals in Corbyn's Labour Party, and the only options open to them would either be to create a new Party, or join an existing one they feel they can align to........or leave politics altogether. The way things look, the Labour Party as we have known it for the last 25 years, is beyond saving, and once this vote is over, it will become an even greater howl-at-the-moon irrelevance, than it is now.
    that doesn't explain why they held back last time though.

    and if they have that "beaten before we start" attitude..what good are they in any party?..they just pussies imo..not sure why you are defending it tbh..they have let themselves and labour down by not standing...and should be ashamed of themselves expecting lesser lights go over the top in front of them..just cowardly

    what makes me laugh is that they keep the same method of picking the leader as the last disaster..surely anyone who didn't like corbyn getting it should have been fighting to change how the leader is picked..because under the present method..corbyn is it until he drops dead

    i have voted labour all my life..but i'll never vote for them again until i see someone with steel take hold of the mess it is now..though that seems highly unlikely..because those that are apparantly heavy weights..have no balls whatsover..lightweights all of them..and thats a shame..i don't understand Benn not standing. What difference does it make if Benn lost to corbyn..at least it would tell the general electorate that someone of prominence was remotely interested in sorting out the great unwashed takeover of the party.

    Its not about whether you can beat corbyn..its about showing you care about what is happening to your party..you show that by standing for the leader job. All that the casual viewer of politics see is a bunch of spineless politicians letting their party get trashed and letting light weights try and fight their battles for them...a poor message to send out.

  8. #1628
    Senior Member Grasshopper's Avatar
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    Last time, there were better/more credible candidates in Burnham and Cooper, which would explain why Ben and Umunna didn't stand.

    I'm not defending anything. I don't have any allegiance to any Party - I'm just despairing at how Labour has progressively gone into the toilet over the last few years; something that has gone at warp-speed since Corbyn took over.

    I'm a member at Cheltenham. If it was bought-over by a nefarious clique of badly-attired, goggle-specs, dandruff-spattered Flatties who proposed running Flat races there, I'd be up in arms. If it became clear to me that this was a progressive move to an all-Flat agenda, I would simply declare myself uninterested, and sign-up somewhere else.

    This is essentially the choice that is now faced by "lifelong Labour voters". The party has been hijacked, and it's time to choose whether it is something you still want to be a part of.
    Last edited by Grasshopper; 21st July 2016 at 4:11 PM.
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  9. #1629
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    Quote Originally Posted by Grasshopper View Post
    Last time, there were better/more credible candidates in Burnham and Cooper, which would explain why Ben and Umunna didn't stand.

    I'm not defending anything. I don't have any allegiance to any Party - I'm just despairing at how Labour has progressively gone into the toilet over the last few years; something that has gone at warp-speed since Corbyn took over.

    I'm a member at Cheltenham. If it was bought-over by a nefarious clique of badly-attired, goggle-specs, dandruff-spattered Flatties who proposed running Flat races there, I'd be up in arms. If it became clear to me that this was a progressive move to an all-Flat agenda, I would simply declare myself uninterested, and sign-up somewhere else.

    This is essentially the choice that is now faced by "lifelong Labour voters". The party has been hijacked, and it's time to choose whether it is something you still want to be a part of.
    i agree with that Grass

    its this apathy to do anything about this that just makes me angry..wtf are they doing letting someone like Smith take him on?..pointless..they deserve everything coming to them imo..they seem to not be able to make a decision about anything and strike out..thats both the corbyn factor and the none corbyn factor

    all i hear is..oh well we will go away and talk about it for a few months then make a decision..fookin tories just get on with it..and that is the difference..rightly or wrongly the tories give the impression they know what they are doing..labour just gives out a message of complete incomptence ..along with the air of soft arsed fookers that will let anybody just walk in and take us over...they don't inspire confidence....and the fact they have a joke of a leadership election that lets people who have a minority view of society take them over... not once..but bloody twice...why hasn't there been a change made to the way they choose a leader?...just adds to the image of a completely unelectable collection of weak willed out of date fools.

    I'm staggered that people will support someone who can't even form an opposition bench...just to keep the idiot they think is the messiah..the left don't want power..they just want what they want..and its nowt to do with changing things for ordinary people..its a pretence just to have hold of the reins...and labour with its barmy leadership process has let them take over.
    Last edited by EC1; 21st July 2016 at 4:30 PM.

  10. #1630
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    That's it essentially

    And the result will also be a further shift towards the left or more accurately towards their hate filled echo chamber.

    Corbyn labour could easily be down to 20 seats in a couple of elections time. Second rate student dumps,' wife beating religious havens and North London wnkrs hideouts
    Last edited by clivex; 21st July 2016 at 4:39 PM.

  11. #1631
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    but that 20 seats is 20 taken from "labour" or whatever they will be called if anyone does decide to break away...neither corbyn nor.."new new labour" will ever see power..all he has done is make sure the tories will rule forever probably...that to me shows he doesn't really believe what he says...he just wants to be.."the man"..anyone with a brain or not totally self absorbed wouldn't even have stood in this leadership election..he is a self centred individual with a watered down Bennite agenda..he isn't original..unless you are about 20 year old with no knowledeg of political history....he hasn't invented a new kind of politics..he is a fake..but gets away with it playing to the ignorance and impressionability of the dicks that keep voting for him
    Last edited by EC1; 21st July 2016 at 4:40 PM.

  12. #1632
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    this is what he's really all about

    At the end of the day its become a quasi personality cult (not that he has one) which has always been a feature of the far left. People on that political wing are usually life losers who need a Glorious Leader to make up their simple minds for them


    With his permanently-in-crisis leadership now facing a challenge and with Theresa May being crowned Tory leader and prime minister, Jeremy Corbyn went to address the Cuba Solidarity Campaign.
    Instead of rallying to defend himself against Angela Eagle’s challenge, Corbyn went to the event in the House of Commons hosted by the group and posted it to his snapchat.
    The Cuba Solidarity Campaign is a movement whose stated aim is to defend the “Cuban people’s right to be free from foreign intervention”.
    This is unlikely to be a major issue to British voters at the next General Election, which may now come earlier than 2020.
    Since unexpectedly becoming Labour leader, the career backbench MP has maintained his links to relatively obscure Left Wing causes.
    Corbyn made no statement about May becoming prime minister and has missed Monday evening’s Parliamentary Labour Party meeting.
    He surprised even Westminster’s keenest observers by attending the Cuba event on a day of political chaos and change.



  13. #1633
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    Quote Originally Posted by clivex View Post
    this is what he's really all about

    At the end of the day its become a quasi personality cult (not that he has one) which has always been a feature of the far left. People on that political wing are usually life losers who need a Glorious Leader to make up their simple minds for them


    With his permanently-in-crisis leadership now facing a challenge and with Theresa May being crowned Tory leader and prime minister, Jeremy Corbyn went to address the Cuba Solidarity Campaign.
    Instead of rallying to defend himself against Angela Eagle’s challenge, Corbyn went to the event in the House of Commons hosted by the group and posted it to his snapchat.
    The Cuba Solidarity Campaign is a movement whose stated aim is to defend the “Cuban people’s right to be free from foreign intervention”.
    This is unlikely to be a major issue to British voters at the next General Election, which may now come earlier than 2020.
    Since unexpectedly becoming Labour leader, the career backbench MP has maintained his links to relatively obscure Left Wing causes.
    Corbyn made no statement about May becoming prime minister and has missed Monday evening’s Parliamentary Labour Party meeting.
    He surprised even Westminster’s keenest observers by attending the Cuba event on a day of political chaos and change.


    and such as the above is the issue isn't it?..its a bit like someone..lets say a doctor..who instead of doing his job everyday goes busking..then wonders why he gets stick from his patients....corbyn would answer that by saying..i know but i passed all my exams..got a large mandate...yes you did Jez..but in the last 12 months..you haven't doctored one fookin person..so you're fired

    does anyone know one person who got a job..failed completely at it..and wasn't sacked for being absolutely useless at it

    only in poilitcs is such a failure allowed to appeal by standing again for the same job he is shite at..and there are divs who will want him to keep it..it defies any logic..but then again..leftie world does.

  14. #1634
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    Angela Eagle, the Labour MP who challenged Mr Corbyn for the leadership, has been told by police to stop holding open surgeries with her constituents over concerns for her safety.

    The former shadow business secretary was told by Merseyside Police instead to get constituents to make an appointment if they wanted to see her.
    It comes after a man was arrested for threatening to kill Ms Eagle and her local party was suspended amid allegations of bullying.

    All Labour MP will be forced to get reselected by their local party before the new general election, Jeremy Corbyn has said, in a move that could effectively allow the Labour leader to sack some of his most prominent critics.
    The Labour leader said after the boundary review concludes in 2018 there will be a “full selection process in every constituency” to see who stands for Parliament.
    Last edited by clivex; 21st July 2016 at 5:23 PM.

  15. #1635
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    Quote Originally Posted by clivex View Post



    All Labour MP will be forced to get reselected by their local party before the new general election, Jeremy Corbyn has said, in a move that could effectively allow the Labour leader to sack some of his most prominent critics.
    The Labour leader said after the boundary review concludes in 2018 there will be a “full selection process in every constituency” to see who stands for Parliament.
    i wonder how shrewd the 4 amigos are feeling now

  16. #1636
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hamm View Post
    Can someone explain to what the relevance of Corbyn's first question was at PMQs yesterday? (on Orgreave) Surely he didn't effectively use his first question on a new PM just to curry favour with union bosses as the new leader election begins?
    It is as relevant as the Hillsborough enquiry was to the victims there. Justice is needed in the case of Orgreave.

    It also served as a reminder that despite all that she is saying, Theresa May is as much interested in social injustice as any other right wing fascist.

    for those who don't know - Orgreave was where the police marshalled striking miners into an enclosed area then attacked them without provocation. The BBC then portrayed the event as having been started by the miners with the police attacking in response. They later admitted that the sequence of events was not as they had displayed it, but have never apologised for it.

    Incidentally, the same coppers who were involved in trying to blame the Hillsborough disaster on scousers were in charge at Orgreave.

    This is an interesting read for anyone bothered.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Orgreave
    Last edited by simmo; 21st July 2016 at 6:01 PM.

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  18. #1638
    Senior Member Grasshopper's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by simmo View Post
    It is as relevant as the Hillsborough enquiry was to the victims there.
    The fight for justice is legit, but nobody died at Orgreave, and it simply isn't of the same scale of importance - nowhere near, in fact.

    Corbyn using this as his opening-gambit a new Prime Minister's first PMQs, speaks volumes. He is more interested in his pet-projects, than being Leader of the Opposition.
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  19. #1639
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    Quote Originally Posted by Grasshopper View Post
    The fight for justice is legit, but nobody died at Orgreave, and it simply isn't of the same scale of importance - nowhere near, in fact.

    Corbyn using this as his opening-gambit a new Prime Minister's first PMQs, speaks volumes. He is more interested in his pet-projects, than being Leader of the Opposition.
    The purpose of mentioning it was because of May's recent cries for social justice which are at odds with her actions as Home Secretary to delay holding an inquiry into it. Something which is continuing under the new Home Secretary. It was exactly the sort of question that the leader of the opposition should be asking. There is plenty of other ammo to fire at Corbyn, this isn't it.
    Last edited by simmo; 22nd July 2016 at 8:05 AM.

  20. #1640
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    You have brexit, nice , turkey and some of the biggest political and economic changes for decades and the first thing on his mind is some strike from 30 years ago

    if it had been any other leader, such peculiar obsession would have been headline news but the dismal standards of this simpleton are more or less routine now

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