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Thread: Not looking good across the water

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    Not looking good across the water

    Funding for horseracing slashed in Ireland


    Brian Fleming


    IRELAND'S finance minister Brian Lenihan has announced cuts in funding to horseracing and greyhound racing of nearly ten per cent.

    Speaking in his Budget speech on Tuesday, Lenihan said the reduction in the Horse & Greyhound Fund would reach 6.6 million.

    That represents a decrease from 76.3m in 2008 to69.7m in 2009.

    Lenihan had earlier announced a doubling in the rate of betting tax, from 1 per cent to 2 per cent.

    More to follow. . .

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    Alot better than many were expecting...betting tax rises from 1% to 2%.

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    10% is not a bad result. I thought it would be a lot worse than that. Am I being too simplistic in thinking that an 8k hurdle will drip to 7k and a 20k novice hurdle will drop to 18k? That's not too bad. I'd advocate a bigger drop in the low grade handicaps to maintain the level at the upper level like good handicaps and novice hurdles.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Cantoris View Post
    10% is not a bad result. I thought it would be a lot worse than that. Am I being too simplistic in thinking that an 8k hurdle will drip to 7k and a 20k novice hurdle will drop to 18k? That's not too bad. I'd advocate a bigger drop in the low grade handicaps to maintain the level at the upper level like good handicaps and novice hurdles.
    Agree, the headline from the RP is way OTT...and yeah I think you're being too simplistic in the prize money levels.

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    i would cut all prize money for group 1, 2 and 3 flat races by 15%. coolmore and their ilk dont need the money, and the flat game does not attract the fan base to justify the excessive prizemoney. i have seen attendance figures of less than 2,000 paying customers for racedays in ireland hosting multiple group flat races.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Galileo View Post
    Agree, the headline from the RP is way OTT...and yeah I think you're being too simplistic in the prize money levels.
    So how does it work Gal? Any insight? I think the loss of sponsors is a big threat.

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    I have spoken to a source in HRI. The early indication is that any race with a P Nicholls runner is to be capped at 10K.

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    Senior Member granger's Avatar
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    god. Hope he doesn't enter any more Grade one's so
    Some people say hes the best since Arkle and thats certainly true when you look at what hes done

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    Quote Originally Posted by an capall View Post
    I have spoken to a source in HRI. The early indication is that any race with a P Nicholls runner is to be capped at 10K.
    He should be banned from sending his horses over here after the blatant team tactics in the last Gold Cup. He should than be publicly flogged and forced to admit that he is a bit slow and doesn't know how to train he's ,just very lucky.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Cantoris View Post
    10% is not a bad result. I thought it would be a lot worse than that. Am I being too simplistic in thinking that an 8k hurdle will drip to 7k and a 20k novice hurdle will drop to 18k? That's not too bad. I'd advocate a bigger drop in the low grade handicaps to maintain the level at the upper level like good handicaps and novice hurdles.
    Prizemoney cuts could well come about, but I would think the capital development plan could be looked at also.

    There certainly will not be extra meetings Sheikh!

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    The recession should do the job that the authorities have set out to do.
    No.s of horses in training will drop.

    It wasn't that many years ago that people (and I recall Johnny Murtagh in particular) where forecasting the end of flat racing in Ireland as any kind of a meaningful Sport due to the lack of people/interest in it. We're headed that way again.

    With so little money in circulation for luxury items such as racehorses, a lot of trainers and breeders will go to the wall.

    Once the pre recession crops of horses have been processed through the racing system there will be any amount of choice of races for those who are wealthy enough to still own racehorses and they won't have to worry about the small people cluttering up the race card.

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    Senior Member Grey's Avatar
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    I've heard rumours that Ireland is not the only place experiencing an economic downturn and that racing might not be the only sector affected.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Grey View Post
    I've heard rumours that Ireland is not the only place experiencing an economic downturn and that racing might not be the only sector affected.
    Exactly!

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    I've recently joined the Council of the Association of Irish Racehorse Owners and I can tell you it was a doom and gloom meeting last night. What I didn't realise is that the link between betting duty and racing's funding has been broken and it is now a grant, one which could be pulled or drastically cut. The government want the betting duty for themselves and will cut the grant over the coming years. It was also noted that Irish racing's greatest political supporters are no longer ministers. So bleak enough times ahead.

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    Senior Member Sheikh's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Grey View Post
    I've heard rumours that Ireland is not the only place experiencing an economic downturn and that racing might not be the only sector affected.
    Eh..what are you on about there Grey, what point are you making that Gal thinks is genius .

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    Senior Member Grey's Avatar
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    I'm just trying to say there may be hard times ahead for racing in Ireland but it will be the same scenario in other countries and many other sectors. I don't think racing in Ireland, or flat racing in Ireland, or even small owners in Ireland are being singled out for particular attention.

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    Senior Member Sheikh's Avatar
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    I don't think racing in Ireland, or flat racing in Ireland, or even small owners in Ireland are being singled out for particular attention
    .

    Racing in Ireland has been singled out by the Government that's why funding is being withdrawn and stallion income is to be taxed.

    Depends on what you mean by small owners, you can be a small owner and have a good horse but naturally most people have average or bad horses.
    The bad horses don't need to be singled out by Hri anymore as the recession will do the job.
    There will be less middle class ownership and this will return Ireland to the time when flat racing in Ireland was a bit of a joke. The same wealthy owners will be winning the races because they're the only ones involved. The logistical problems that large no.s of horses in training caused also resulted in more competitive and better standard racing at the top end.That's just common sense, more horses in training, means more good horses and more bad horses. Coolmore , the Aga or Moyglare etc winning wasn't a given. I don't think we'll be seeing any Elletelle's etc for a while.

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    Assuming of course the economic climate is like this for the next 10 years...

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    Racing in Ireland has been singled out by the Government that's why funding is being withdrawn and stallion income is to be taxed.
    What governments give they can also take away. That was always the weakness with the new funding arrangements for racing. Regarding stallion fees, many would say breeders were singled out for special treatment by making them tax exempt in the first place.


    That's just common sense, more horses in training, means more good horses and more bad horses.
    I don't think your assumption is correct. The best of the horse population will always be retained for breeding, even in a recession. When numbers grow it is because lower quality mares are being brought into production. More bad horses, yes, but no extra good horses apart from the occasional fluke.

    There will be less middle class ownership and this will return Ireland to the time when flat racing in Ireland was a bit of a joke.
    I agree that middle class ownership is likely to decline. The main impact will be on 2-y-old maidens and handicaps. Smaller stables will suffer. Similar things will be happening in other countries and in other economic sectors.

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    I don't think your assumption is correct. The best of the horse population will always be retained for breeding, even in a recession. When numbers grow it is because lower quality mares are being brought into production. More bad horses, yes, but no extra good horses apart from the occasional fluke.
    Grey, your assuming by removing bad racers from the breeding poole and breeding only from the good racers that the no. of good horses bred will grow.Simply not the case.

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