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Thread: British Racing Funding

  1. #1
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    At a time when the general feeling is British racing needs to increase prize money and quality levels this is reported in the paper today. Really is a mess....

    Crisis looms as bookies threaten huge cut in levy
    by Howard Wright
    .

    BRITISH racing is facing the frightening prospect that its levy income could be slashed by 60 per cent next year, to around £33 million, compared with the latest working forecast of £85.5m for the current 2007/8 yield.

    Although an increase in payments for betting-shop pictures would offset a proportion of the cut, the effect would be devastating for racing, which is already having to come to terms with falling levy yield and imminent cuts in prize-money.

    As well as providing around 60 per cent of prize-money, Levy Board contributions impact on virtually all sectors of the industry.

    Areas that would be severely affected include integrity, veterinary science, racecourse improvements, staff training and marketing.

    The potential for a staggering drop in money available from central funding has come about principally because of the major bookmakers' reaction to the emergence of Turf TV as a second provider of live pictures for betting shops.

    To put the figure of £33m in perspective, should that materialise, it would be on a par with the levy yield in the early 1990s – when there were 50 per cent fewer fixtures than will take place next year.

    From January 1, Turf TV will have exclusive rights to deliver pictures from 31 racecourses - 30 aligned to Racing UK, and Ascot - but 80 per cent of betting-shop operators, including the big four of William Hill, Ladbrokes, Coral and Betfred, have declined to take up the service and confined their coverage to SIS, the previous monopoly supplier.

    On Tuesday, the Levy Board's bookmakers' committee, was putting the final touches to its submission, which signals the start of the statutory process to decide how much the sport will receive from the betting industry.

    No-one was prepared to comment ahead of Wednesday's opening skirmish, but it is understood that the bookmakers will put forward a scheme by which the current basic levy payment of ten per cent of gross profits from UK racing is reduced by an amount equivalent to the cost of taking Turf TV, plus one-third of the fees payable to the Gambling Commission under the new Gambling Act, which came into force on September 1.

    Each shop will be charged £6,500 a year for Turf TV from January, but non-subscribers - which represent a majority on the bookmakers' committee - say they pay £1,600 per shop for equivalent coverage at the moment, and claim therefore the net cost to the industry for taking what they already have would be around £50m.

    The bookmakers' committee is expected to recommend that individual contributions towards the £50m should be deducted from levy payments.

    It will also propose a further global reduction, adding up to at least £2m, to account for extra costs of regulation attributable to UK racing under the fee system introduced bythe new Gambling Commission.
    Under these proposals, rough estimates suggest the levy yield would fall by somewhere in the region of £52m, to about £33m, but with everyone paying for pictures from Turf TV courses, the amount contributed bythe betting industry for these overall rights, including those already sub-contracted to SIS, has been put at around £36m.

    The resulting calculation makes grim reading for racing, since the combined total for levy and pictures would be little more than £70m, compared with £125-130m a year presently.

    The bookmakers will argue that the impact of taking Turf TV pictures as an addition to current costs is unlike an increase in a utility, say electricity, which is the cost of carrying on a business.

    The counter argument - that the cost of Turf TV has nothing to do with levy payments but is the price for pictures that bookmakers can take or ignore - will be led by racing's representatives on the Levy Board.

    The BHA board is building a case for the levy to produce more money for racing and is expected to impress the need to examine the level of contributions made by betting exchanges, and ask whether it is sensible to retain threshold limits for bookmakers in a gross-profits regime.

    The process for agreeing the 2008-9 levy scheme around the Levy Board table runs until midnight on October 31, after which it has to be referred to the DCMS secretary of state, James Purnell, for determination.

  2. #2
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    Bookies are ###### in a nutshell for me!! Take take take and no give! I would love it if we go the way say France and Hong Kong. Wont happen but it will be good for 'racing'. Yes, from a betting perspective its not so good but racing will be on a continual downward spirial the way it is or has been going.

    I've been thinking lately its funny that prizemoney etc is getting cut all the time, yet we still get the Sheikhs, Coolmore, JP various others spending millions on horses more than ever, yet the financial reward is simply not there. Michael Owen has invested millions in a new yard for instance. British racing has a lot to thank its history and the prestige because money wise, its nowhere compare to the rest of the world.

    This downfell in Levy is a sorry mess and one I unforunately see the bookmakers winning, With the emergence of football and other sports as betting mediums ( i cant believe the amount of money bookies take on football these days, all those Man Utd, liverpool accas!) , racing needs someone in power to take a different approach or run in a different way otherwise, it will just go downhill like greyhounds. Racing is still far too good to go down that route, the important word there is 'still'.

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    The Levy article goes hand in hand with another by Howard Wright in today's RP, truly scary stuff as it sounds as though prize money for the bread and butter races is going to take a hammering. Class 4 races are pretty competitive fare and most owners would be delighted to have a horse good enough to run in them; above that level it can all get a bit rarefied so Class 4 could be the summit of many owners' realistic ambitions. It's just going to make life so much tougher for owners who are already struggling to win anything. I don't suppose training fees will decrease as a result, not with feed prices going through the roof along with most other costs these days...

    Anyway here's that article:

    BHA to make cuts to
    minimum values

    OWNERS of moderate horses racing in Britain will find the going even tougher in 2008, following the BHA's decision to target cuts to minimum values at the bottom end of the quality scale.

    Classes 4, 5 and 6, which are generally limited to horses rated up to 85 on the Flat and 115 over jumps, have had their minimum values reduced by double-figure percentages.

    The lowest-grade Flat races will have a £2,600 total prize fund in 2008, compared with £3,000 this year. The equivalent over jumps will be £2,400 (from £2,700), outside hunter chases, where the minimum has been cut to £1,250 from £1,400.

    At the other end of the scale, cuts of 2.7 per cent and 5.9 per cent have been applied to minimum values for Group 1 and 2 races for three-year-olds, but the level for Group 3, Listed and most Class 2 races has been maintained.

    The minimum for all Class 1 and 2 races for two-year-olds will also remain the same.

    BHA racing director Ruth Quinn said: "With a £5.5 million drop in prize-money from the Levy Board, minimum values had to be addressed to avoid wholesale downgrading of the race programme.

    "The BHA board was very keen to take an approach that protected, as far as possible, those races at the top end of the scale, as opposed to applying a fairly consistent reduction across all classes."

    Quinn added that Britain's international competitiveness was a factor in the decision.

    After accumulating £2m, including £500,000 from the Levy Board, in a development fund that will be targeted at specific races, the BHA measures will result in a £5m net loss to centrally funded prize-money in 2008 – £3m for the Flat and £2m over jumps.

    The need to address minimum values came about after falling income from the betting industry forced the Levy Board to reduce its prize-money contribution from this year's £55m, which was accompanied by a re-evaluation of the basic daily rates of prize-money (BDRs) paid to each course.

    Quinn said: "We are aware the reduction in BDR payments will not fall evenly,so urge courses with above-average cuts to contact us, so that we can work through the implications for their race programmes."

    The Racecourse Association had recommended an across-the-board cut, particularly on the Flat, with a degree of flexibility,which, it argued, would protect middle-ranking courses that strive to put on better-class races.

    RCA race-planning executive Carla Moore said: "Courses like Beverley, Hamilton, Pontefract, Thirsk and Windsor, which stage Listed races and decent programmes, will have more difficulty keeping up their quality.

    "Opportunities at the bottom end haven't changed, whereas they might disappear from mid-tier courses, if they have to reduce a big race to the minimum value simply to fund other races.

    She added: "There is bound to be a lot of juggling of prize-money, but the certainty is that more races will be run at minimum values, and more Class 4 races on the Flat will become Class 5.”

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    Thanks for that Vixen...a depressing read for all who follow the sport.

  5. #5
    Senior Member Harbinger's Avatar
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    You're absolutely right about the prestige being the only thing propping up the top end of the sport in Britain, Will. If stallion fees were directly related to prize money won, the Derby and King George would be about the only Group 1s left on the British calendar.

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    British racing relative to other major nations is really up the creek.

    Look at our maiden race values at Ascot and Newmarket compared to other top tracks around the world - $45,000 maidens at Santa Anita, even more in Japan.
    Hurricane Fly - whatever he runs in he wins

    Twitter: @Quevega

  7. #7
    Kathy
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    I am tempted to start a petition that owners of horses rated between say 35 and perhaps 65-70 refuse to run their horses anywhere in the UK. This can be done periodically until the penny drops that despite having a lack of speed to qualify to run in some of the richer races many of these horses do contribute to the racing industry and this fact needs to be recognised. Owners pay good money to trainers to try and achieve their goal of winning a race and it is expensive enough without finding that the prize money for so many races rarely covers the cost of a months or a month and a half training fee's. How can that be right? shrug::

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    If all this turns out to be true, then it represents the culmination of nearly 50 years worth of intense arse-licking of bookmakers by racing's rulers (and racing journalists and broadcasters).

    Of course, we should have had an off-course (at least) tote monopoly for decades.

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    Interesting post Kathy

    A couple of questions and no offence meant, i'm interested in your answer to the below



    1) What do you and other owners contribute to racings coffers besides entrance fees???

    Excuse my ignorance, but the reason i ask is, as an owner:

    You seem to contribute to the breeders income, who seem to make a decent living

    You seem to contribute to the trainers income, some of whom make a decent living

    You seem to contribute to the jockeys income, some of whom make a decent living


    2) Do any of the above contribute anything back to the racing coffers after charging you a small fortune????

  10. #10
    Kathy
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    Originally posted by charlieD@Sep 19 2007, 09:07 PM
    Interesting post Kathy

    a question and no offence meant, i'm interested in your answer to the below


    What do you and other owners contribute to racings coffers besides entrance fees? The horses to race with to start with. No owners = no horses = no racing = no betting

    You seem to contribute to the breeders income, who seem to make a decent living - Not a penny from income just expenditure. I am no expert but I would be amazed it I ever cover my outgoings and let's face it alot of breeders make absolutely nothing which I am sure I am soon going to find out .

    You seem to contribute to the trainers income, some of whom make a decent living - Some of them may but many of them are constantly living on a wing and a prayer and the dream of having a top class horse in their yard one day.

    You seem to contribute to the jockeys income, some of whom make a decent living -

    Yes, great fun sometimes paying jockeys who then occasionally totally ignore the trainers instructions and as an owner you have waited weeks/months to get into a race (any race) to watch a jockey **** up the whole process in less than 3 minutes and comes back with the biggest load of bullshit of an excuse you have ever heard and I've heard most of them.

    Do any of the above contribute anything back to the racing coffers after charging you a small fortune???? Not sure they give anything back financially but without them there would be no racing. I still feel the owners above anyone else get the roughest deal more so in this country than any other. Why is that? shrug::
    Charlie, after typing this out I have now realised I have absolutely no idea why I am involved in this industry!
    :rant:

  11. #11
    Kathy
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    Originally posted by Will@Sep 19 2007, 01:00 PM
    Michael Owen has invested millions in a new yard for instance.
    There was a programme about Michael Owen last week Will and it showed Michael Own and his new yard and facilities. What some trainers would give to have his money and facilities. The programme showed Frankie Dettorri dropping in to ride one of Michael's horses and it did a fantastic bucking routine in the yard with him on board, and Frankie was like a circus act/rodeo act and managed to stay on. Great TV - not sure it would have been shown it Frankie had fallen off though.

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    I can understand your frustration Kathy


    As an outsider looking in, it seems to me that you and other owners invest decent sums, but none of this investment gets put into the lower end prize money pot

    It's siphoned off by the breeders,trainers and jockeys etc

    So should these people pay a levy similar to what the bookies, exchanges do??

    Those who make feck all contribute nowt, but those who do, pay

    Thus, they are contributing something to the racing pot

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    I sympathise absolutely with Kathy's point of view, since I too have been paying out training fees for the last few years, with almost no return [2 horses, 1/8th share, total of 3 x seconds, and a third, my share of which didn't even pay my whack of the racing plates and the boxing fee to the course!].

    Owners [and breeders, many of whom go racing to see their progeny run] contribute hugely to the industry - which incs all the farriers, vets and other specialist, horse transporters, feed merchants, tack-makers, work riders, and all the other peripheral people who are necessary to the industry, as well as spending a good deal of money on the racecourse itself.

    But let's stick to the main topic, which is the bookmakers' attitude to the levy. I'm in total agreement with Venusian here: the tail has been wagging the dog for so long, that the tail now has more muscle. How to retrieve the situation, that is the question; and I can't see how it can be done short of some very tough action at the top in the face of the Big Four. The Turf TV row has only brought to a head what has been simmering for a while now.

    I wish Betfair would take a lead here.

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    Originally posted by Headstrong@Sep 20 2007, 12:06 AM


    Owners [and breeders, many of whom go racing to see their progeny run] contribute hugely to the industry - which incs all the farriers, vets and other specialist, horse transporters, feed merchants, tack-makers, work riders, and all the other peripheral people who are necessary to the industry, as well as spending a good deal of money on the racecourse itself.

    If these people contribute so hugely to the racing coffers, why is racing so reliant on the levy and why are people on this thread showing concerns for the drop in levy payments????



    what an owner like Kathy does do as pointed out above is, contribute to the Darley, Coolmore etc breeding business, a Stoute, Johnston etc training business, a farrier business, a vets business and to a jockeys income etc, etc

    A successful bookmaker makes money from racing, a successful exchange makes money from racing, but they pay something back via the levy.

    Other successful businesses that make money from racing should imo do the same

  15. #15
    Kathy
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    I went to Wolverhampton racecourse recently and took a friend with me who had never been. She was quite impressed. You have to pass through a hotel at the entrance to the racecourse whose 55 rooms were all fully booked for the evening. The racecourse was well staffed, even though there could have only been about 1000-1500 in attendance. The Wulfrun Suite which the annual members and owners share had leather seats and there were 4 members of staff behind the bar.

    The point I am making? The majority of racecourses I go to, and I have been to a few, seem all to do well. OK, they have to use the tracks for other things apart from racing but it does grate on me that racecourses can be so well staffed, not many people/punters around and the prize money is so desperately inadequate in so many areas. Racecourses are normally well staffed, clean and have mainly great facilities Compare all of this for travelling two or three hours to go to a racetrack with the thought/hope/dream that you may win about £1200 as an owner if your horse can get past the other 11 in the race. If your horse comes 3rd you can sometimes win as much as £250

    Perhaps we should just get rid of all horses rated 60 or less. Thousands of horses to rehome or retrain, but what is the point of keeping them in an industry that clearly doesn't want them. They clearly are all surplus to requirements. It is an insult to these owners to pay them less prize money year on year.

    If the owners of these less talented horses don't revolt evenutually, they are basically saying it is OK to treat us and our horses as idiots or 2nd class citizens as unfortunately, as we all know, you do not pay training fees according to your horses ability or lack of it.

  16. #16
    Senior Member Honest Tom's Avatar
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    It's a pity that the bookmakers and racing/turftv can't both lose this war. The bookmakers for being greedy b@stards and racing for being an institutionally corrupt shower of feckers.
    A curmudgeon barely alive

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    Surely this is something the RP should be actively taking a stance on...campaigning for less bookmaker influence etc?

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    There is a great deal more to 'the racing industry' than just prize money Charlie. Owners contribute a huge amount in other ways, eg financing Weatherby's - you should see some of the bills we get! - who run the registration and banking system. The point that Kathy, myself, and other owners are making is that the whole system is dependent on us, the owners, who shell out huge amounts of money so that racegoers, punters, and bookies can profit from *our* investment, in fun as well as financially.

    The bookies are by far the main net profit-makers, aside from huge owner/breeder empires like Coolmore - so why should the bookies not contribute more of their profits to keeping the show on the road? Any money put up in prize money tends to go straight back into the wider industry, ie to pay for all these people who keep racehorses bred, sold, fit, fed, and on the track.

    It's no coincidence imo that quite a few of the biggest owners and breeders started off in the bookmaking business.

    The turf TV war is insane. It's going to end up with people like myself getting Sky and staying at home to bet online. Spread over the country that will soon result in the closure of a lot of shops, which will hit the kind of pensioner punter I see so many of here in Suffolk - they go to the bookies to meet their mates and have a yarn and a bet and a laugh. The big bookies are cutting their own throats. I make it a principle now never to bet with any bookie who won't take TurfTV, so I stick whenever I can to Betfair and PP online and PP and Jennings in the shops

  19. #19
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    Headstrong

    Read my posts again, because you seem to have missed what i wrote - I'm on your side

    I'm not on about who pays the largest share, what i am on about is people contributing who take from the pot

    There are too many people inside racing taking out and not giving nothing back, but if thats what they want to do, let em

    It is these very same people who will feel the effect when owners like you, Kathy etc chuck it in

  20. #20
    Kathy
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    I worked out last night that I could take myself and 5 friends on an around the world cruise - first class on the amount I am spending on racehorses and funding the racing "industry" in a 12 month period. That includes an outside cabin with a balcony. (they are evidently much cheaper inside! )

    Now hang on.... at the moment, which of those options would I really prefer to do?

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